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Sunshine Podcast Guesting In Understanding The Science of You: The Power of Labels: Are They Helpful or Hurtful?

In this enlightening episode of “The Understanding Science of You,” the Podcast delves deep into the world of labels and the profound impact they have on our lives. Special guests, including personal development coaches, explore the dual-edged nature of labels – how they can both empower and constrain us. From understanding the role labels play in shaping identity to examining the potential psychological consequences, listeners will gain a comprehensive insight into how language influences perception and behavior. This episode promises to challenge preconceived notions, sparking a dialogue on whether labels serve as helpful tools for self-clarity or harmful barriers to personal growth. Tune in to uncover the science behind the labels we use and discover ways to foster a more nuanced understanding of ourselves and others.



Graham Skidmore  00:00

Well, welcome to the inaugural podcast of understanding the science of you. And it’s only fitting it wasn’t planned that Jennifer sunshine romanovski is joining me, by the way, for the sake of this cup of this podcast, how do you want to you want to be gentle? Sunshine?


Sunshine   00:15

You want to say yes, absolutely. All


Graham Skidmore  00:18

right, groovy. All right. So either way, I got both of them out there. For those that know you by Jen, those who know you by sunshine, you know, we’ve drawn that connection here. So, you know, somebody who’s been with me, throughout my crazy walk about a year over the last six years plus my prior life, it’s only fitting that you as I start this next chapter of life, you know, kick, kick it off with me as well. And so, you know, as we as, as I take on, you know, a new identity, a new set of labels, whatever you want to call it, I thought that, you know, the way that that would be a great introduction, and understanding the science of you, is kind of starting by understanding different labels, right. And, you know, and the purpose in, you know, in these conversations, is just about helping people to feel comfortable, you know, in their own skin. So essentially, that’s our conversation today is to be our I should say, you know, our driving intention behind the conversation today, today, is to be open and vulnerable and real, to talk about the ugly, right, because that’s what people can relate to, to learn from. And so I just want you know, so we just want to have a safe space, to talk about the real stuff, and how we, you know, in the journey of becoming comfortable in our own skin. So, you know, that being said, let’s see what we can do about, you know, helping to make some people, you know, feel happier about themselves. So I’m good you,


Sunshine   01:37

I love it, I love it. And I’m really excited, I think, I think this is, this will be a really good topic, to really to start with the kick everything off, because hopefully, we’ll talk about some labels today that, you know, will resonate with folks that will say, yeah,


Graham Skidmore  01:52

it’s definitely, you know, I would be lying, if I didn’t say that I have some anxiety, just even acknowledging some different levels about myself, whether I make them or others secondary, they’re still coming as a result of stepping out of the comfort zone. Right. So yeah, this is surely going to be very interesting. So let’s just kind of start with, like, I’ll give you my thoughts on labels. And then I want to get kind of your takeout, right. So in so I’ve got, you know, I’ve kind of got a love hate challenge with them. Because on one hand, you know, I get very angry and frustrated about labels, and, and both having labels applied to me, or even trying to reference myself as a label to be real, to be relatable. Because I don’t want to be limited. And I want to feel like I’m defined don’t don’t have to put me into a box, right? But on the other hand, right, if I have no labels, and I’m totally fluid and nothing, then it makes it very challenging for me to relate to people find a place of belonging, so to speak a sense of community, and other things, not to not to mention that I’ve also found tremendous relief, I’m just going to call it right, because I’ll struggle looking for words at times. And so finding other labels, and just like their definitions and descriptions, and things like that will will allow me to understand and adopt new words and new vernacular that helps me to articulate what I was feeling but couldn’t say. And so then it’s like Uber helpful. Right. So anyway, so I’ve always kind of got this push pull between whether I liked them don’t like them, you know, and anyway, so let me just pause there and say, you know, what’s been your experience? And have you kind of gotten at peace with that part? Yeah,


Sunshine   03:21

you know, I think, I think there’s a lot of folks that will be able to resonate with that. And I think a big difference of what you’re talking about of the like, or the not like so to speak, you kind of touched on it, it’s when a label is applied to you, when somebody else gives you that label and tries to indicate you are this right, this is you when you haven’t selected chosen or told them. And I think a lot of times what happens in those instances is people are often weaponizing those labels as well, right? They’re giving you the label of you know, and I’m sure we’ll get down to some of these point, you know, autistic, and they’re doing it in order to weaponize it against you like, Oh, you are different, these are the things and, and trying to tell you and describe how you are to you, rather than trying to have that conversation getting to know you. So I think, you know, I’m not a huge fan of a label that’s applied by another individual. You know, that’s just, it’s my personal opinion, I think, when we are going to, you know, step into these labels, or these personas, or these areas of ourselves and accept them as some, you know, part of our identity, I think the most important and critical piece is that we’re choosing what they are, and we’re choosing what they mean. Right, not somebody else,


Graham Skidmore  04:38

you know, so just sort of see that I really wrote it down because I think that’s, I think not just labels but so many things in life, right? When things are applied to you, you know, what’s called against your will or against the or your desires, right? Versus you choosing them or telling them to be applied to you, right? It’s two very different situations. But then when it’s also weaponized against Do you then then, you know, that’s like a double whammy. And you go, Wait a second, you’re like, This doesn’t seem fair. There’s no way there’s no way of getting out of this. And that, you know, once you want and once you fall into that weaponization of labels, so let’s talk about that. Because I know that I won’t, I know that I have been subjected to the weaponization of labels. So let’s talk about some controversial labels. Maybe not controversial, but non traditional labels that might make people awkward or uncomfortable when you’re around cocktail parties that you would apply to yourself for people to kind of recognize you and relate to you. Yeah,


Sunshine   05:36

there. I mean, there’s a whole whole handful of them. And I kind of laugh and chuckle every time because I swear, I add a new one, you know, at least once a month, but I think the very first one that tends to be very controversial is the fact that I’m a witch, you know, and I consider myself an eclectic witch. I’m also a psychic medium. I’m a high priestess. I’m a magician. I’m a Reiki Master, I’m a healer. And I consider myself hope a soul healer. I’m neurodivergent. You know, and I’ve ad ADHD. I am, I’m a recovering alcoholic. You know, and that’s a big controversial things. You know, sometimes people will get into a tiff around that one, I don’t know that there’s a single label that I would apply to myself that couldn’t raise the, you know, the hairs on a few folks, depending upon the audience that I was in? Yeah.


Graham Skidmore  06:30

Okay, so that’s quite at this. So speaking about, right, so that gets right into my point of well, or I guess what I believe what I feel like is great about you take what works for you. Right, and you kind of leave the rest? Yeah,


Sunshine   06:44

you asked the question of like, how do I how do I get comfortable with it? You know, and I, you know, I’ll tell you, it’s a, I think the number one thing is I made the choice, right, I was the one that chose to apply these labels to myself, and all of them haven’t been, you know, they often haven’t all been comfortable, you know, it just even when I go back to two, probably most controversial is, you know, labeling myself a witch and living labeling myself an alcoholic, you know, and it took me probably two years of looking at my relationship with alcohol before I was willing to admit that I was an alcoholic, and literally put that label upon myself and I will, I will continue, you know, I there are some, there are some folks that step into recovery that you know, will decide to not embrace that term to describe themselves anymore. But to me, it’s a really huge part of my own, you know, sober journey is accepting that label. And then, you know, from the winch perspective, this one is a, this one’s a really interesting one. Because my person myself, actually loves the thought of keeping it private, right, there’s like, a little bit of a secrecy and, you know, kind of, like fun with that secrecy. And, you know, haha, like, look at me, I’m a little witch over here, you know, but it was about a year and a half ago, through like meditation, and, you know, talking with my, my own spirit guides and things of that nature where they said, I’m sorry, you can no longer hide, you have to make it No, it’s part of your journey, that’s part of your purpose is to show people that embracing this path, these beliefs, and the spiritual practice actually has a purpose in life. And it’s not something that’s trivial, or something that should be, you know, judged as being innately evil. And I still, you know, even though it’s been a year and a half, since I’ve stepped into that label in the public space, I still even just, as of two days ago, had somebody in my private messages, you know, ridiculing me and chastising me, and then it flips into this, like prove it type of mentality, show me your true powers your job, you know, and it’s just, I think the most important thing with any label that we’re going to choose is to know that the moment we do that, that means there are other people that have the ability to judge that label. You know, and you have to be comfortable with allowing the judgment of others to roll off your back. Yeah. And I don’t care what label it is, there’s always going to be someone that is going to judge it. And you have to be able to let that judgment roll off your back.


Graham Skidmore  09:37

You know, aren’t you and I want to take the time to reiterate. And that’s what my hope is with this. And my focus with this podcast is a separation because this from here, we’re not going to talk so much about what those labels are, right? Because that’s not the purpose, the purpose, you know, what we’re what we’re wanting to talk about, right is how do you feel comfortable with those labels? How do you find out whatever labels are right for you? What are this Things are what are the challenges that you face in doing so? And also what are the opportunities as well, though, right? And that’s really what this conversation is about, right? It’s not about trying to convert people to think one way or another. It’s the exact opposite, right? This is about how to get how to help people experience the freedom of thinking for themselves. Right. So that being Yeah, so that being said, I know you started kind of talk about some challenges, you know, and so let’s talk about that. Because it’s always easier said than done, right? Like, it’s always like, you know, I know that it’s easy for me to, to puff out the chest and go, I don’t care what anybody says, and you know, and have that combative, masculine type of response, but the reality is behind the scenes, I’m just like, well, you know, what, why are you? Why are you? Why are you trying to make me like trying to make me sick? Give me a sad face, man, that’s not cool.


Sunshine   10:46

How do I navigate? You know, what’s the literal? You know, I think the first thing is, you know, I’ve talked about you being the individual that chooses, and I think, before you even understand how to navigate the judgment, or the hate, let’s be real, sometimes that judgment comes with a big ol backsplash of hate behind it, you know, you have to make sure that you truly are comfortable with whatever it is that you’re labeling yourself. And so to me, one of the biggest practices that I’ve had, you know, in my own recovery is being really, really comfortable with how my body talks to me, you know, and understanding the somatic responses that my body is having, you know, when we put ourselves into uncomfortable situations, or if I were to try to adopt a label that wasn’t really truly aligned, you know, like, let’s say, I wanted to call myself a kind of Hawaii, this popped into my head, a pickup artist, you know, greater influence and persuasion, like, I’m gonna just adopt this, you know, my body, even just thinking of that, right now I get like, a little bit nauseous and uncomfortable like it, I’m not a big fan of it. Right. And so learning how to listen to your body to ensure that what you’re choosing to label yourself or identify yourself with, I think is a really, really big first step. Because when we do that, the judgment or the hate or whatever else comes our way. Right? almost has like, our body almost has its own kind of like protective barrier, to not allowing it to, like, we have this place that we can go that says no, this is true. For me, this is right. For me, this feels good for me, and what you’re saying or how you’re projecting your judgment, or your hate, doesn’t resonate, right. But if you don’t, if you don’t go through this, like this exercise, and for some people, you know, I told you accepting the identity of the witch and like using it in a public space was probably a year long journey, right of me talking with like, back and forth with my guides, are you really sure and testing little things and see how people responded. And, you know, there was always I felt okay with it. But it was when I put it into these public spaces, that this discomfort would happen. And that’s that was the key was recognizing that it was truly the other individuals discomfort, I was feeling not the discomfort with the decision on myself. Right. Other people were uncomfortable with me referring to myself as such, other people were uncomfortable seeing this in, you know, their public space or after their Facebook feed, because my name literally reflects that now. In a so to speak, and so you have to be really confident that the labels that you are choosing to accept are labels that you you believe ring true, right? And if, if that’s not the case, you know, I’m just getting these like pictures in my head of why. Why I think some teenagers and some younger individuals really struggle is because the years between the ages of like, things like 12 Until about 17 are intended for you to try a lot of hats on, right to step into a lot of different identities and to like test and to see what feels right and what doesn’t. And the unfortunate truth, it’s also probably the most critical time from our peers. Right? And so it’s really easy to ignore that true semantic response because someone else is trying to override it for you. You


Graham Skidmore  14:38

touched on something quite a few times there. And I want to back up the bus in a second here to earlier in your journey. But while we’re talking about this, I want to first do a plug because you know, for both can I say we work at by the way is that cool? So both I wanted to plug for both Quicken Loans now Rocket Mortgage and And both for direct because to your point, like in both cases, you know, I knew you in the corporate world and I saw you come in as your different self. And in some cases that was simply different colored hair. And other cases that was different colored hair and tattoos shown, right there were definitely there were definitely non traditional. So a kudos to both of those places for allowing an environment for to really be cool to for it to be cool for people to genuinely be themselves. And the other thing that I will tell you is, you know, watching and observing various marketing data, things like that. When I look around a place, and if I don’t see, you know, a final sea of pink hair, I don’t see it, you know, a nonconformist, you know, amongst them. And I know, everyone’s thinking the same, right, the quote unquote, weirdos are, where that is where a lot of the free thinking happens. So you need to every company needs a hand flow. So anyway, so I just, you know, it’s important under state standards, well, that even in large companies like that, your identity, what you’re talking about is accepted. Right. And so a lot of the uncomfortableness was fears that you were kind of placing on yourself from others what was out there, more so than necessarily how you would be received? You know, and that’s, and I think that’s a huge point, that I just wanted to give you a chance to kind of get into, no,


Sunshine   16:10

I mean, our, our society, and I’ll say, you know, here, we’re in America, right? There might be some cultures that are don’t, you know, agree with this, but our society literally is built for conformity. Right? We, we, you know, we’re little, tiny children. And then around the age of four or five were put into daycare, we’re in a group of, of, you know, students or folks, we’re taught in the same fashion, if we don’t learn in the same way, we’re ostracized from that original group, and literally put into another group that’s supposed to learn in the same, you know, fashion. And so like, we we just, our society is like, Hey, here’s a box, you should get comfortable in this box. This is what you should be, by the way, after high school, it’s college. I mean, there’s so many prescribed paths that it’s really hard for us to, I’ll be 45 this year. And so I just go back and I look at how hard it was to be myself as a teenager, right? Because of this conformity, and my early 20s. Because of this, like, this literal, like conformity of like, here are here is what you’re supposed to be doing. Right. And I just, it never felt right to me. And so I was, you know, very blessed that I found, you know, environments that allowed me to be my strange and unusual self. And, you know, frankly, I’m, I’m blessed that even though I succumb to a lot of that conformity, there was still a spark within me, that knew that me being different, was not only okay, but it was something to be celebrated. And even though I might not have done that in a public setting in the past, right? I never, I never allowed myself to shame myself for it. I may have been shamed by others. Right, I may have had others apply that, you know, what are you doing, you’re a weirdo, you’re crazy, all that kind of stuff. But I never like that’s where I said to me, even that which title, there was this, like thrill of keeping it secret, right? Because that has been the most shame that’s been applied to me over the course of the many years. But ya know, I myself never allowed myself to fall into patterns of shaming or guilting myself for a label or a choice or a decision or a weirdness that I had. And even to this day, I have plenty of people that sit down in front of me, you know, clients and folks that I work with that, you know, I’m going to say something weird what I’m about to say so strange and IBM like, go for it because like, there really isn’t like I have zero judgment on on weird and strange. To me, that’s what makes life worth living is the weird of the strange the conformity stuff as well. Yeah.


Graham Skidmore  19:13

Well, it seems like it was no doubt it seems like the tides are changing. And the weird in the strange seems to be rolling in pretty quickly. Compared to you know, let’s say the little if you look at it, the pace of the last, you know, few decades. So I want to get kind of literal here for a second on, on on the fields. Because I know like when I’ve read things, and I listen to people, and they’ll be like, oh, yeah, you know, I felt this and you’ll know and, like, I’m like, No, I don’t know if I knew I wouldn’t be listening to you trying to find out what it means to know. I’d be feeling that I’d be doing it right. So what you know, so like, help people to understand how did you know when you talk about it felt right, right? Like, what didn’t like how do you know like, literally the feeling inside of when something doesn’t feel right to you, versus when it does he’ll write, and how you kind of, you know, I guess let’s talk a little bit about that how that served you early on in your life, how you kind of muffled it, right? And then how it’s made its way back to being much more of a guidepost for you now. And you trust it.


Sunshine   20:13

Yeah, you know, I can’t go into any of those conversation without, you know, referencing once again, that I’m a recovering alcoholic. And I have been when I go back, and look, I’ve been drinking since the age of eight. You know, and I’m not talking about every night with a six pack as an eight year old, right. But I mean, I have a lot of memories of being around that age, and literally seeking out half finished glasses of you know, Roman Cokes, my father, you know, wouldn’t finish. And, you know, I’ve looked back a lot at that, and a lot of that was to numb, right, the alcohol was to numb these feelings, food, have used food to numb feelings for you know, many, many, many years, work, to numb feelings, right to distract the mental thought process and give you something that is productive to be, you know, spending your energy in. And so I’ve, I’ve done a lot of these patterns, you know, I say I’m a recovering alcoholic, workaholic, perfectionist and control freak, a lot of these patterns to numb that these feelings in these sensations. And so it wasn’t until I got onto the other side of of recovery and started to really be willing to feel and what I mean by feeling, you know, we can go ahead and you know, any, anybody that’s listening, you can pull up a literally look for like an emotional, emotional wheel. Like you can type in Google emotion wheel, and it’ll show you like a list of literal emotion words to describe emotion. And that’s one piece of it’s one component. But when I’m talking about feeling, I am referencing the feeling in our actual body, right? And so think about all of the times there’s a lot of folks you know, you might walk into a room, you might walk into a new place, you may meet a new person, and you’ll be like, they’ve got a good vibe. They felt okay, or this building feels weird and creepy, like our body is a barometer, it is a literal, you know, you know, our aura extends about eight feet out from a so any place that we walk into go experience, even a thought that we may have can give us a literal body leads sensation, right? The challenge is, so many of us have done exactly what I was doing through most of their life, they found some other way to numb those sensations through alcohol, drugs, food, sex, you know, chaos, drama dramas are really huge one, I’ve had a couple of conversations with folks lately, where people will literally be in drama cycles to avoid and ignore what they actually truly are feeling and witnessing. And so our body will be what resonates, you know, and this can feel like, you can feel sick, like literally physically sick, nauseous, uncomfortable. Heaviness, tightness in chest, poor digestion, slow digestion, or you can literally feel an energetic, you know, shift and change, I feel more energy, I’ve been able to sleep better, anything of that nature. And so when I talk about feeling, it’s literally looking inwards to the body itself and asking the body how is it feeling? And I don’t mean that emotion word, I mean, the literal physical sensation in the body. Right? That, to me is one of the biggest indications and I you know, that somatic response of a tightness in the chest, right? Or like that sickness that you’ll kind of feel like your whole stomach kind of like clenches in or even this feeling, you know, how it shows up for me sometimes with stuff is like, I will literally feel like something is hard to do. Right? Like if I’m supposed to be go out this afternoon, I’m supposed to meet someone for coffee or something of that nature. And I’m like, Oh, my God, I can’t even get up. Oh, the day Oh, like that, even alone is the body’s way of showing that there’s something not aligned with the introduction. Yeah, the body is the number one truth teller.

Graham Skidmore  24:18

It’s funny, as you’re sitting there talking about those things, I was like, check, check, check. Yeah, been there that one too yet. And into your point where like, you know, I didn’t know at that time I didn’t know about myself as sensitivity or picking up on you know, energies of others and things of that nature. And so all of those other ways of dealing with it, right? And then, you know, sound like we all sit around talking, which is again, are the reasons podcasts we don’t all sit around talking about how we’re actually feeling and wonder does everybody feel this way? Does everybody go through this stuff? What’s normal, right? Like we all kind of our thing with or at least you know, I feel like I just I read realize that I actually don’t know how everybody else feels. I I don’t know if everybody else goes through this. Right. And so that’s part of, and what I’ve learned is through these more open and vulnerable conversations, that you know, that there’s a lot more people that go through it. Right. And it’s, it’s now it may not be the exact same situation, but the emotion behind the stuff right of, of what of what is experienced, you know, is is definitely there. And you’re and it took me a long time, I looked back and I, you know, and I had to learn how to understand the difference between when is my stomach hurting, because I just ate some bad food? And what is my stomach hurting? Because it’s telling me that I’m not being true to myself right now. Right? Is this nauseousness? Again, because, you know, why am I feeling nauseous? And most of the times it was because I learned that it’s because I’m holding something. And I should be saying, right, I’m not being true to myself, I’m not being genuine. And you know, and those are, these are all common things. I just take some times and yeah, and event and of course, I took plenty of pills to make the fields go away, because I don’t know what they were right. So yeah, you can override the body talking to you. There’s, there’s ways you know, I mean, so turning it off, it’s not, you know, my challenges, I just didn’t really come with a dimmer switch, right. For me, it was either on or off, as far as I, you know, kind of knew. And so, when you talk about then what feels right, I guess I would kind of add to that to just say, because this is this is right, where is it? Also what happens after that, right? Because it’s one thing to say, oh, you know, I read this, this, and that seems like me, so I’m gonna identify with this. And I’m gonna kind of start to adopt that label. And I’m gonna kind of try on that close, close. And, you know, and see how it feels. And then there’s the watching to see how everything else happens around you. Now, you know, I don’t want to get caught up in trying to sit in trying to say, now watch people look for all kinds of reasons and everything that happens to you. And if there’s information that’s, you know, has significant life, meaning no stuff that happens to someone just information and everything significant meaning by the stuff that happens to us, right? And so but how would you tell people then to look at what type of cues to look for to say, the universe is supporting me based on these clothes that I’m starting to wear? So that’s kind of a sign that I’m in line, right. Some people may say look for synchronicities. Right, what would you kind of,


Sunshine   27:14

you know, the synchronicities can be really good. You’ll also watch like the moment you start to adopt, you know, and you step into a label that feels good, you’ll often start to watch the universe kind of shift and align towards that. So you might start to see more folks that are like, oh, yeah, I actually I, you know, I’m neurodivergent to Oh, actually, I’m a witch. Oh, you know, so you’re gonna start to see some of that validation. But on the flip side, you’re going to start to see some folks challenging it as well. And that’s kind of the universe’s way of saying, like, Hey, man, you took on an identity, like, are you you know, are you sure? Like, are you sure, and it’s not, it won’t happen forever. You know, like I said, the gentleman that challenged me just here a couple of days ago, I probably haven’t had someone do that kind of work with me. I don’t know, probably about a year, you know, but it just so happens that I’m about to venture out and do some changes within my own business. And so like, of course, someone’s going to pop up and challenge my own, you know, confidence in myself, you know, like the the universe’s is able to deliver both really beautiful lessons like these people aligning towards you again, you finding new paths, new opportunities, new stores, I mean, I can’t tell you, I, I don’t know if I’ve ever shared this story with you. But I remember in my 20s, I had started to research and you go down the path of trying to research more magical practices aligned to like the Golden Dawn and Aleister Crowley and some of these really old gold magicians, and I could never find anything. I couldn’t find the right books. I go into, like, you know, bookstores, they wouldn’t have anything present there. And I just couldn’t and so I like dismissed it and you know, left it and it’s only been now on the other side of recoveries, I stepped back into my spirituality that they just keep flooding to me. Right? I’ll have a book. Oh, have you ever read this before? I you know, would you like to read it? And I’m like, Oh my god. This is a book that I was literally looking for 1520 years ago, right. And so you’ll watch these synchronicities. You watch these things, you know, kind of pop up, people come in situations come in. You may even see some things around like songs, movies, music, all to validate that you’ve chosen maybe the right path, the right label. But the moment you also have that questioning and challenging happening, it’s validation as well. Right? When you start to watch someone and frankly, like, if you take any more controversial type of labels, you know, if the folks that are listening, decide to go down the path and take something that’s pretty controversial. What you’re going to find is those folks that are channel plunging you are actually meant to exit your life. Right? That’s like the universe’s way of starting to show you that these are not the people aligned with that path with that next step that next phase. So yeah, the, the feelings are one thing, I think folks are gonna get synchronicities in another way. And you’re just going to start to see more validation on both sides as well, right or more things are on lining to take you down that path and more things are challenging you. Because the reality is, as much as we may want a high vibration life, we might want a life filled with peace, love and happiness and joy. There are a lot of people, there are other people out there very often around us that are struggling with that and would much prefer to have you down on their level. You know, Misery loves company is the state.


Graham Skidmore  30:56

So, so talk, so let’s Yeah, so let’s, let’s talk about a different level here. So it’s always easy to see, it’s easier to have these conversations that are in hindsight, right? When you have the ability to experience and everything to to prove stuff out. So let’s take this back to before like, right, like earlier on in your life, right? It sounds like you talked about, you know, feeling and what feels right, and taking the time to be present, and listen, and then you also use an old term meditate. And I want to talk about that for a quick second. Because while you know, yes, there’s very specific disciplines of meditation or, or teachings within it, you know, and I think that sometimes that’s what people think that that’s what you have to in order to be in order to be meditative, or be thoughtful or to be present, right? It has to be something very structured like that, right? But sometimes, but you know, but for the purpose of this conversation, and when we think about meditation, and being able to be present and listen to yourself, like what’s a more simplified, distilled down version for somebody who doesn’t want to think about themselves in a meditation room meditating?


Sunshine   31:58

I mean, the way I’ve always described meditation is meditation is awareness of thought. Right? That’s all it is, you know, another way to look at it is going to be mindfulness, like being very mindful of where your thoughts are, and where they’re not. And so for some people, you know, if we were to go down, like and really talk about folks that are on this, like enlightened path, you know, you might get into these conversations around like, meditation is clearing of thoughts, and you’re just able to sit in peace and be with no thought, for an hour. Right? And, yeah, that’s lovely, and little really wonderful. And that would be an amazing place to get to, but it’s not realistic for most people. Right. And there’s a lot of people that I’ve talked to you that they, they, they stop going down the path of trying to meditate, because they can’t get this silent, silence of mind. Right, they just can’t get to it. And so they think that they, they’re not good at meditating. And so I always say, all meditation is is just the awareness of thought, recognizing, oh, that’s interesting. I’m wondering why this thoughts coming up, but not right now. We’ll go ahead and revisit that later. Right, and allowing those thoughts to just come and go, maybe there’s one that you sit with a little bit longer. Maybe there’s one, you know, for example, I said, you know, through meditating and talking with my guides, when I was told that I actually needed to embrace the title of the wedge like, that came through, I literally, you know, the meditation is I was dancing. I had music on, and I was just in my living room. And I was just dancing. And I was just allowing my mind to just enjoy the music. And it was, you know, it wasn’t even in a lyric at that particular point. It was this kind of download of knowing that just came through. And I said, that’s interesting. I said, What do you mean, you know, and that’s when they, you know, my guides responded with, you have to embrace this title, it’s part of your path, it’s part of, of what you’re meant to do in this next phase of your life. And so, yeah, it’s when we, when we’re conscious of our mind and more aware of it, you may find that through that meditative state or this awareness that you get information beyond just your thoughts.


Graham Skidmore  34:19

Right. So and So receiving information, and there’s a time or so I think you would also have experienced that we may have received the same information many times in our but there just comes at one time when it’s the intersection of the information coming through and our ability to hear it the way that it needs to be heard. Right. And so, I know for me, I had a point in my life where I finally said, Alright, this is this is crap. There’s no way that the human body is just designed all of a sudden just be on pills and feel like and feel horrible, right? Like there’s just no way that this is as good as it gets and that this is what we’re meant to be and on the other hand, right, don’t get me wrong. taking a pill, you know, to make yourself feel better is a nice thing. And then the other side of the coin was like the, oh, well, it’s just because you don’t have a healthy body. And so other things are going wrong with you, for example, right, like I got, so I’ve gone down a path or wear glasses. Okay, so Eastern Medicine says that me needing glasses is due to, you know, some challenge, I can’t remember, if so please, didn’t my, like the liver and other, you know, just the body’s ability to work together as it should properly so that for the body in itself isn’t healthy enough. And so therefore, the eyes are just a symptom of that, right? And it’s just telling that to me, so I’m like, Alright, cool. If that’s gonna be the case, I’m trying to feel like I’m the one that’s broken, I’m gonna get healthiest can be and see if my eyesight any better, right? And so yeah, I’m saying this on camera, and, you know, but like, that’s, and then working with my friends that are Eastern practitioners to say, hey, look, walk me through this guy’s right, because you guys believe that we can do these things. I want to believe that I can make myself feel better. But yeah, I don’t look around and see all of these examples of all of this stuff happening necessarily. And again, that could be the difference between Western culture and Eastern otherwise, either. But either way, the point is, I don’t see it. And so I want to see more of it, I want to believe I’m willing to put in the effort. So somebody helped me do it. And so that’s when I got to that point. And I started to then understand myself in a very different way, right? I sort of learned and listen to my body and started to be open to it. And it was, and it wasn’t even trying to get to it from that direction. So I just got, I got sick and tired of feeling sick and tired. What was your I guess, transition point, or what used to be your first transition points, many, where you were younger, you didn’t know what you were feeling, you just knew that you were tired to kind of feel a different way. And you started recognizing that your body was guiding you to feel other ways? And once you Yeah, and that got your attention? Yeah,


Sunshine   36:49

no, it did. And so, you know, the interesting thing is, I don’t think I think so. And we go back to that whole statement that I said, this conformity, this train this like, what we just get on, and we just start going and going and going and never take a pause or a stop. And, you know, talking with a friend earlier today, we were talking about like retreats and things of that nature. And I think, you know, I think it’s really important that we always have moments within our lives that we stop what we typically are doing, like when we get off of that train, and just stop and look around and take notice. And so for me, the the time that became so, so intensely transformative for me, you know, in a number of different ways, right? You know, our past life together, we both worked for Quicken Loans now Rocket Mortgage, and I had to the towards the latter part of my time there in that career, I had to take a leave of absence, my father was really sick. And so I took this leave of absence. And so for two and a half months, I was around the medical field tending to my father and my mother helping to care for, which gives you a lot of time to start thinking about, you know, and forces you let’s be real, when you’re facing mortality in the face, right, by a loved one about to crossover, you’re being told, you start to like, look at life differently, you start to question and you start to challenge it, you start to wonder, and you know, I just at that particular point, I had a marriage that was, you know, had dissolved. One of the things in that marriage that my ex husband had told me was that I was too involved with my work and didn’t have enough time for him in the relationship. And so I’m also watching my father, like on his deathbed, and the way that he was kind of, you know, I was mirroring this workaholism of his right. And, you know, that leave of absence. And going back into the office when it ended, and feeling how intense the energetic was in my body at that point. Like, it was a real eye opener of this is not the right place. For me, this isn’t where I’m supposed to be my whole nervous system went on like this. Heightened, you know, for lack of a better way to describe it, defense. Right, like, it felt like the moment I stepped back into this corporate environment at that point that every bit of me wanted to be on a defense that it needed to like fight that it needed to like pull up armor, and you know, and I was like, God, is this the way I want to wake up and show up in life every day? Is this is this okay? And the answer was, No, it’s not. You know, and the moment that happened, all of these blinders started to come down. And I started to see, you know, some of this the toxic projections that I was putting onto the environment around me. And it was just at that point, it wasn’t just them. Like it wasn’t just the environment and the folks that I work with, but it was who I was when I stepped into that environment. And that was the workaholic Have perfectionist, the control freak and the alcoholic? Right. And it was at that particular time it would have been in 2008 17, the end of 2017 that I started to, like, take a step back and really, really question for the first time whether or not that train was what I really want it to be.


Graham Skidmore  40:27

Wow, well, that’s, that’s very vulnerable, I think a lot of people can relate to those feelings of when when we were able to take the time to stop and be present. And listen, and sometimes that can be just doing it when you’re brushing your teeth getting ready, right? Like some 100, let’s let’s be real life happens. So there’s not a we don’t all have time to go sit in a room for a while, right, you got to, you know, find those little moments. So just be very present for two minutes at a time, right. And things that are so unfortunate, we’re starting to, you know, having to wind it down. And I hate to do that at the end of such a beautiful story. So I do want to give you the opportunity, I’m going to bring up some points, I want to give the listeners an opportunity to understand you and how to reach out to you as well. If this stuff relates to zoom, before we get into you and what you do, are there any last minute words of wisdom or things that didn’t come up that you would want to share with the listeners? No,


Sunshine   41:25

I think I actually think it’s like a really beautiful point to kind of like wrap because the sentiment there, we started this talking about labels, right, we started talking about labels, some of the importance of labels, some of the challenges of it. And at the end of the day, the biggest thing that I recognized and realized is I had to give enough time to myself to be able to step off of that train, as I said, just for a moment, you know, to be able to look around and recognize that these labels other people had put on me, right? The the like party girl that loved to drink, you know, that was socially all of these other labels weren’t the labels that I actually wanted, they weren’t the labels that made me feel good. They weren’t the labels that like, nourished my soul and made me feel as though they were relevant to a purpose that I had here in life. And so, you know, that’s that, to me is probably the biggest thing to state, you know, for anybody that is listening, and you’re hearing any of this for the first time. And maybe you had that somatic, you know, response, maybe you had this, this feeling of like, Oh, my God, I totally get that, like, you know, just give yourself a second to pause, you know, and it doesn’t have to be two and a half months, right? It might be two minutes, while you’re brushing your teeth, as Graham said, but just give yourself that moment to pause and truly ask yourself are you happy with the way life is? Are you happy with it? Are you fulfilled?


Graham Skidmore  43:00

You know, what question not necessarily easy to answer. That one takes a different type of look in the mirror. Yeah. And so you know, it looks. Now I would say when you’re wanting to learn from somebody, right? You want to learn with somebody who’s looked in the mirror, you want somebody who’s had experiential knowledge. So based on what you just said, and I want to recap what you talked about here, and in giving you credit for your experience and knowledge and for the listeners to relate to as well, which is we said, look, if you’re going to adopt these things, here’s kind of here’s the things to look out for and to be prepared to be prepared is number one, it’s you should feel real to you. Right, it should feel like you’re willing to, you’re comfortable kind of getting made fun of being called that, right for lack of a better way of thinking about it, but there’s just that level of certainty, right? And expect to be challenged for that matter, right? If something is important. It’s ingrained enough to you, like, you know, you’re here to learn, right? And so that the universe is going to provide you those opportunities to learn and ingrain yourself, right? And so the universe kind of says, Hey, if you’re not willing to believe in yourself, how can you ask me to believe in you, right? So show me why this is who you are, and I’m going to support you. And I think that that’s an important part, too, is is to not to view those things not to view headwinds as negativity, not to view challenges as negativity, right to understand them as being as accurate as actually positive KPIs and let you know you’re on the right track and reinforcements that’s right reinforcements and then the last thing is just also understand that sometimes the indicators that you’re on the right track is that your life around you is kind of changing those that are around you might that may be in it may not be in it, right? People that were around different perspective will find their way to not be around anymore. And so if judging, you know, people leaving or otherwise as the only thing, then that’s a challenge, so what I would say is if people are living your life and everything else you’d like to go into shit as well or my language, then yeah, okay, that there’s probably something else going on there. That requires some deeper reflection. However, if people After life, but yet you wake up feeling better every morning you feel more clarity, you feel more comfortable in your own skin, you feel good walking out the door. Okay, then then that’s indicators that yeah, you’re that, you know, you should feel good about the path that you’re on, et cetera. Right. So this type of experiential knowledge and understanding is, you know, has been helpful at all sunshine, what is exactly kind of the you do? And how might what you do be able to help our listeners that, you know, have enjoyed our conversation.


Sunshine   45:29

Yeah, you know, there’s a lot of business folks that would say, I should have a very clear and succinct pitch line right there to tell you, and some of that, in my own journey right now as being defined, I will tell you, the people that I am looking to help the most are individuals that truly know and understand that they identify as a witch, and that they are looking to change their life, they want to recover from this life, you know, they want to get off that train. And they want to step into something that they have more empowerment in more hope and more optimism. And I you know, I say recovery. I’m a recovering alcoholic, workaholic, perfectionist and control freak. But I say that you know, anybody that is suffering from kind of the addiction to lower vibration, so this can be drugs, sex, alcohol, violence, shopping, food, sugar, drama, and chaos. Those are real, two big ones that I watch people cycle in and out of. And so if you are tired of living a life that just does not feel aligned to where you’re meant to go next. That’s who I want to reach out. We’ll help you recover from the life that you once lived and help you walk into the life that you’re meant to live. And


Graham Skidmore  46:43

how do you want them to reach out to you? Yeah,


Sunshine   46:45

you can find me. My favorite way is sunshine. It’s sunshine readings.com. That’s my email address. I sit on the other side of it. It’s my favorite way for folks to find me. You can also look on Facebook, Instagram, for Sunshine readings. And this is the website to Sunshine reading SATCOM. Yeah.


Graham Skidmore  47:04

Well, I can’t thank you enough for being open, being vulnerable, right? Talk sharing the ugly, you know, I hope that people were able to, you know, bring a smile, a laugh relatability anything, you know, as well, I know, I always get stuff out of our conversations. And so I know we’ll be on here again. And so I just want to a thank you again for showing up. And then secondly, I know you’re going to as well to start in your next chapter of life. So you know, straight up, sending you much much strength and support my friend, you know, for the universe to support you and get your footing as well.


Sunshine   47:37

I adore being here. Thank you for having me, Graham. Already. Take care everybody.

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